wretched

*Independent Fundamental Baptist
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wretched last won the day on October 5 2016

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About wretched

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    But to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.
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    But to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.
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  1. Oh dear friend, this passage from I Timothy is not referring to self or family defense in its context in any way. Nor is Luke 22:36-40 referring to actual violence. It is yet another fulfillment of prophecy in which our Lord frequently declared in the Gospels during various situations. In this case the prophecy fulfilled is Isaiah 53: 9-12. "v. 12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors." Our Lord was to be numbered with the transgressors. The swords made our Lord's arrest legal (at the time of arrest). Peter was rebuked by the Lord for using one of the swords and not over timing. Can't you see that? He did not come here the first time to destroy men's lives, but to save them. We are commanded to be like Him in these matters and point men to the Savior, not to destroy men's lives. Luke 22: 36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. 37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end. 38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough. It wasn't nearly enough for the self defense of all of the disciples but it was enough for the arrest and fulfillment of Isaiah 53 I will say this once again and pray some will listen. It is blatantly contradictory to believe that Jesus even excuses, much less condones, encourages, or commands violence to any other human being down here for any reason. "Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also." There is not and will not be any time in your remaining physical life where it is OK to resist evil or disobey any of our Lord's commands. To do so is sin, to teach others to do so will regulate us to LEAST IN HEAVEN. Matthew 5: 16. Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven. v 19. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. Carrying a pistol with the intent to shoot someone in self defense is not Bible Christianity. We were not spared eternal torment to continue to live under Adam's rules and mindset. The Gospel results in the exact opposite of the natural man. Please see the Sermon on the Mount. One could only pray to be slaughtered for Christ. If we truly believe the Gospel, we must then follow the Gospel and strive through the Word and prayer unto Christlikeness.
  2. Men or Christ is always the real issue in these debates. Remember the words God gave us through Paul: "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?" Don't ever be of a man for any accomplishment or publication. And yes, if a person follows their writings, purchases their writings and defends their writings - they are of that man. TULIP cannot be found in the Word of God, it can only be learned through men's writings. Regardless of which man teaches calvinism, our only goal in this life is to be like Christ. That is the Scriptural result of the new birth and is a huge part of the Gospel. Now if our goal is to be like macarthur, spurgeon or anyone else than keep studying their writings by all means. But and this is the point I pray is understood: If our goal is to be like Christ; stick with the Bible only, focus on the NT Gospels first to grasp all things whatsoever He taught His disciples, dump the confusing merchandise of men, start over again and let's saturate ourselves only in the Word. Whatever our "goal" in this life is - will settle the matter of our salvation. If we have any other goals "great or small, religious or otherwise" we must revisit the matter of our souls.
  3. Remember, I said at all levels. Revival as far as the Scriptures support would be primarily an upsurge of prayer for power resulting in true conversions. Remember that our Lord fasted 40 days to begin His ministry. That is an example that should be understood and followed at every level of ministry and every level of ministry must be geared toward converting, baptizing and discipling.
  4. He further explains in the 12th chapter "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me." It is all from His perspective still brother and not intended to ever be our perspective. There are a 100 to one passages commanding us to warn everyone.
  5. I appreciate the kind reply sir. However, I can cite hundreds of NT Scriptures that demonstrate our purpose while here physically. Of course starting with our Lord's great commission to us. In addition all Scripture overwhelmingly points to absolute and total free will for men lost and saved (from men's perspective which is what this thread is all about and all that must matter to us). The scattered passages here and there that supports your view are always written from the Lord's perspective. Not one instance exists otherwise in Scripture. Please see that what you are claiming here is in fact making God's functional view of history your own functional view of history which is false and presumptuous. He knows exactly how much fruit we each will bring to perfection through obedience to God's commands to sow with tears and the power of His Spirit. However, if we cripple ourselves falsely from the start with this notion that God controls men's minds and hearts, we will never bear any fruit nor bring any to perfection. Street evangelism becomes merely academic and a stench in God's nose IMO. Revival (or as the OP stated - soulwinning) at all levels hinges solely on importunity my friend. Persistent, non-stop pleading to God for His Spirit's power. It won't be easy by any stretch. Real prayer is the hardest thing to do and double hard if you fast as our Lord demonstrated. Look at it this way friend, if God cannot force us to feed on His Word daily and lose our earthly ambitions completely to Him as saved people do you honestly think He forces anyone to believe to begin with? Study Luke 11:5-13 and please reconsider.....
  6. Sir, please consider the following: God's viewpoint is displayed in the context you quote dear friend. Not our viewpoint. The Lord knows all and sees all, knows who will believe and who will not throughout the ages. We see only free will and must warn everyone period. The spreading of Christ's Gospel is our earthly purpose. So, to say that there is nothing wrong with witnessing is a gross understatement when you and I have no other purpose here, wouldn't you agree? God would logically just take us home upon the new birth if His seeds are spread and watered without us..make any sense? He gives the increase but we are tasked to seed and water. Wouldn't you agree that no one can believe without hearing the Word of God. The Spirit and the Word work together as one to save and sanctify. It has never occurred spontaneously without hearing the Word in the Spirit's power. The more earnest, secret, private prayer that a believer puts in, the more of the Spirit's power will be present when they witness. Nor has any believer ever gotten close to Christlikeness from the standard 3/10% religion promoted by many pastors. It can only come by daily saturation in the Word, which enables believers to pray according to God's will. This post's intention is not to address the calvin heresy. It is addressing the supreme purpose of witnessing and testifying the Gospel of Christ. I do agree that the sale's pressure should never be on a believer. The sincere burden to see souls escape hell should be however. We must warn them and tell them that we are warning them. The level of success however is in direct correlation with the amount of tears, prayer and fasting we commit to and never wisdom of our words; like sales tricks, etc. Just some thoughts without contention.
  7. I say good riddance to him
  8. Interesting. I think you will find most (there is that word again) on this forum will agree with you. James and Paul both simply echo and rephrase the teaching of our Lord in all the Gospels. The only saving faith is that which produces works for God. No works (no interest in baptism or the milk of the Word, or growth, or sanctification, etc.), no saving faith....period. What new born baby fresh out of their mother's womb does not want milk immediately? Multiple millions claim faith in our Lord but very few demonstrate faith to our Lord. The Gospels and Epistles all proclaim this truth that is so often ignored. In every instance of the faith hall of fame of Hebrews 11 the saving faith was demonstrated to God by works. How many times did Jesus tell people though-out the Gospels not to "tell Me" but to "show Me". Example: No man having put his hand to the plough and looking back (at their old life), is FIT for the Kingdom of God. The early churches fell quickly into the apostasy of "dead faith" or what we call easy believe-ism/easy prayerism and this is what God used James to correct. Sadly apostates even within IFB circles continue to spread this unrepentant "gospel". It amazes me that many times the lost (who don't want to hear it) seem to know naturally what supposed "Christians" don't know about the true Gospel. It will change their hearts, minds, attitudes and their lives in every aspect. Enter satan who taught IFB "soulwinners" to dance around that to simply get a quick prayer out of people so they can report baloney numbers to each other or to falsely console themselves over lost loved ones. They actually have replaced Christ's teaching completely and are spreading a false (albeit easy) substitute for the Gospel. It is a cost counting substitute that Christ warned everyone about repeatedly throughout the Gospels. These "soulwinners" sell a quick prayer and never mention the necessity of baptism and discipleship. Christ's command to us is another of the hidden 3 in 1's in the Bible. Faith, baptism and growth to Christlikeness. Anything short of that is failure. Failure as in the parable of the sower's 3 failures to one true conversion. Why do they not include baptism and growth, you ask? because they don't want to know the reactions and answers to that from these false converts. They sold this person the all you have to do is say these words "gospel". This way they can report large numbers and look like a hero to the rest of their church. It is TARES trying to make more TARES IMO. Not so much many of the ignorant members but those in authority that teach this method of witnessing (despicable heresy). The world calls being born again things like: Finding religion or finding Jesus or becoming a Jesus freak or a Bible Thumper or a holy roller. They know it changes the person's life, the devils know it changes a person's life, God most assuredly knows it changes people's lives. Seems everyone knows it except modern professing "Christians". Mental acknowledgement of the Gospel produces no works for sure. Saving faith in the Gospel produces works without exception. One sows, another waters BUT ONLY GOD GIVES THE INCREASE. Prayerfully and carefully witness with gravity and tears and let the lost say to you "what must I do to be saved". You know, treat all people like you would your own relatives. Who sells their loved ones an un-convicted prayer?
  9. Very interesting, I wonder how many other hidden-in-plain sight trinities there are in the Word. I am thinking of a couple but it would need a new thread I reckon.
  10. HA, now that is a good point that I have never considered.
  11. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called: But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: That no flesh should glory in his presence. There will not be many (if any) earthly rich, many beautiful, many powerful people in God's Kingdom. Through God's omniscience this is a theme throughout Scripture. Reason being that these people via free will are not poor in spirit. They are full of the pride of life and their hearts are almost never "good ground" for God or the Gospel. There is no fear of God in their eyes. They have received already, their consolation.
  12. Miss, I get it, I have been caring for a 15 year old grandson for many years. There is no Heavenly reward for doing what the heathen do naturally (taking care of family). He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it. He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me. Stop worrying over the world and injustice. Living in America means you are rich beyond measure compared to 90% of the world regardless of your income bracket. Lose your care for social problems and government, pick up the cross DIE TO SELF and follow HIM. Live the rest of your life trying to spare all people you come across from hell.
  13. Miss, You will not be judged on what happens with the government or the world. YOU WILL BE JUDGED ON WHETHER YOU LOST YOUR LIFE IN THIS WORLD AND PICKED UP YOUR INDIVIDUAL CROSS AND FOLLOWED HIM. Follow Jesus in your individual small part of the world and you will be rewarded. Wasting your time with what is not in your control is a waste of your God given time to prove yourself to God.
  14. Looking forward to HS' reply but while waiting, a thought came to mind, I pray it edifies: All newborn babes grave mother's milk immediately after birth and are insatiable in appetite as they initially grow; so should a newborn Christian be with the Word of God. Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings, (more references back to Christ's teachings in the Gospels as in all the Epistles). As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby: God makes this analogy for a clear reason in righteous judgment for us. If our "converts" don't grave the Word of God right away after trusting Christ, go back to the drawing board and keep praying and explaining the Gospel to them. We should not be tempted to push assurance of salvation on them. Just as we must not be tempted to sell them an empty prayer. That is how tares are made IMHO.