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Dealing with rejectors.


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#1 ThomasCooper

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 01:17 PM

My fellow Christians,

Recently I had a debate of sorts with a satanist woman who insisted that she was a Christian. That despite disrespectfully talking to a man. What's more, she and her crowd were adamant in rejecting 1 Tim 2:15, getting upset and rejectionist regarding the reality of her going to hell. How do you deal with such heathens? How do you minister to them?

In the blood of the Lamb,
Brother Thomas

#2 Bro K

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 02:05 PM

My fellow Christians,

Recently I had a debate of sorts with a satanist woman who insisted that she was a Christian. That despite disrespectfully talking to a man. What's more, she and her crowd were adamant in rejecting 1 Tim 2:15, getting upset and rejectionist regarding the reality of her going to hell. How do you deal with such heathens? How do you minister to them?

In the blood of the Lamb,
Brother Thomas

My suggestion would to give her appropriate bible verses and then pray that the Holy Spirit will use them to touch her heart. Many times I believe that WE try to do the convicting; which can only affect one's mind, instead of their heart. For the most part we do not see the results of the "seed" that has been sown. Keep on...keeping on. God's Word will not return to Him void.

#3 CPR

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 02:56 PM

My fellow Christians,

Recently I had a debate of sorts with a satanist woman who insisted that she was a Christian. That despite disrespectfully talking to a man. What's more, she and her crowd were adamant in rejecting 1 Tim 2:15, getting upset and rejectionist regarding the reality of her going to hell. How do you deal with such heathens? How do you minister to them?

In the blood of the Lamb,
Brother Thomas


Do you mind if I ask what made you come to the conclusion that she was a satanist? I only ask because I think that can be a dangerous term for us as Christians to throw around. If this lady said that she was a Christian, she may or may not have been, but I'm not sure how you made such a leap based on the information provided. I think sometimes Christians try too often to preach to the converted just because they may not agree, which leads to questioning salvation.

I think the important thing to remember is to encourage in love. If they are a Christian they will be encouraged by your attitude. If they are not, then love is what everyone needs anyway.

#4 JerryNumbers

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 03:21 PM

Taking that she is into Satanist things, and shows complete disrespect, why argue, debate, with her, for no doubt, this fits her quite well.

Pr 23:9 Speak not in the ears of a fool: for he will despise the wisdom of thy words.

Pr 17:24 Wisdom is before him that hath understanding; but the eyes of a fool are in the ends of the earth.

For with the disrespect she showed you, there is no way she will respect God's truths, so are you not casting pearls before a swine?

Mt 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

When a person is the way she is, once that is found out, its time to stop the debate, for it will go no where. I know, at times its hard to find the place to pull up stakes, for we keep hoping they will see the truth.

#5 CPR

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 03:38 PM

I with you on that point, and I think that in that situation debate and hammering on a point can actually drive a person away from Christ. That's why I said in that situation we should just do our best to show love and move on. However, I missed the part in the post where it was clear that the person in question was into things of Satan. I was asking because I think that we create unnecessary divisions as Christians when we label people who disagree with us as heathens. That may not have been what happened here, but in general, I don't think it's a good practice.

#6 ThomasCooper

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 04:49 PM

Do you mind if I ask what made you come to the conclusion that she was a satanist? I only ask because I think that can be a dangerous term for us as Christians to throw around. If this lady said that she was a Christian, she may or may not have been, but I'm not sure how you made such a leap based on the information provided. I think sometimes Christians try too often to preach to the converted just because they may not agree, which leads to questioning salvation.

I think the important thing to remember is to encourage in love. If they are a Christian they will be encouraged by your attitude. If they are not, then love is what everyone needs anyway.

Satanism is any rejection of the doctrine (Bible, KJV 1611). Matt 12:30. That woman clearly stepped outside of the boundaries laid out for the womenfolk, was arguing with a man, and was insisting that she was doing nothing wrong. We should encourage in love, but our love must be stern. Especially when dealing with the foolish types.

#7 CPR

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 05:19 PM

Satanism is any rejection of the doctrine (Bible, KJV 1611). Matt 12:30. That woman clearly stepped outside of the boundaries laid out for the womenfolk, was arguing with a man, and was insisting that she was doing nothing wrong. We should encourage in love, but our love must be stern. Especially when dealing with the foolish types.


I'm not trying to cause contention or force an issue, I'm really just asking a question here because I want to understand where you are coming from. Of course we are all coming from a position of trying to adhere to the Bible. I understand one position derived from 1 Timothy that women should not be pastors. Are you extrapolating that to suggest that a woman should never express disagreement with a man?

#8 HappyChristian

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 05:48 PM

Satanism is an active worship of satan. Stepping outside the bounds of Biblical lines by a Christian isn't satanism - but it is disobedience to scripture. I would not go so far as to say that a woman arguing with a man was satanism. Unwise, yes. If he is her husband, also unsubmissive. If he isn't her husband, then she is not Biblically bound to submit to him unless her husband has given her permission to do so. (and if you are not her husband or pastor, you really don't have Biblical basis to rebuke her...you could, however, go to her husband, if she's married; her pastor if she's not. If you are her pastor, that changes things)

My concern is that you say she claims to be a Christian, and yet you relegate her to being a heathen satanist. You cannot see her heart, so to assume she is not saved due to her having an argument with a man is stretching it, imo.

One thing that many Christians seem to forget when dealing with people is that people are sinners. Yes, there is often rebuke needed, but compassion is necessary as well. Remember how Christ dealt with the woman caught in adultery? He didn't call her a heathen or a satanist: He forgave her. He told the Samaritan woman where her sin lay, and He forgave her.

I would say that when dealing with people who are choosing to sin, name the sin, but do it with compassion.

#9 CPR

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 07:21 PM

Satanism is an active worship of satan. Stepping outside the bounds of Biblical lines by a Christian isn't satanism - but it is disobedience to scripture. I would not go so far as to say that a woman arguing with a man was satanism. Unwise, yes. If he is her husband, also unsubmissive. If he isn't her husband, then she is not Biblically bound to submit to him unless her husband has given her permission to do so. (and if you are not her husband or pastor, you really don't have Biblical basis to rebuke her...you could, however, go to her husband, if she's married; her pastor if she's not. If you are her pastor, that changes things)

My concern is that you say she claims to be a Christian, and yet you relegate her to being a heathen satanist. You cannot see her heart, so to assume she is not saved due to her having an argument with a man is stretching it, imo.

One thing that many Christians seem to forget when dealing with people is that people are sinners. Yes, there is often rebuke needed, but compassion is necessary as well. Remember how Christ dealt with the woman caught in adultery? He didn't call her a heathen or a satanist: He forgave her. He told the Samaritan woman where her sin lay, and He forgave her.

I would say that when dealing with people who are choosing to sin, name the sin, but do it with compassion.


Thanks for posting that, I agree with most of what you are saying. It is important that we are respectful to everyone, and I think that it is very dangerous to label people as things that they are not. By the logic of the OP, there should be no women debating on this board!

I notice that Christians sometimes tend to think, "If you don't agree with me, then you must not be a Christian." We need to be very careful because more often than not this is not Biblical, is unnecessarily divisive and drives people away from Christ.

#10 PreacherE

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 07:24 PM

Satanism is an active worship of satan. Stepping outside the bounds of Biblical lines by a Christian isn't satanism - but it is disobedience to scripture. I would not go so far as to say that a woman arguing with a man was satanism. Unwise, yes. If he is her husband, also unsubmissive. If he isn't her husband, then she is not Biblically bound to submit to him unless her husband has given her permission to do so. (and if you are not her husband or pastor, you really don't have Biblical basis to rebuke her...you could, however, go to her husband, if she's married; her pastor if she's not. If you are her pastor, that changes things)

My concern is that you say she claims to be a Christian, and yet you relegate her to being a heathen satanist. You cannot see her heart, so to assume she is not saved due to her having an argument with a man is stretching it, imo.

One thing that many Christians seem to forget when dealing with people is that people are sinners. Yes, there is often rebuke needed, but compassion is necessary as well. Remember how Christ dealt with the woman caught in adultery? He didn't call her a heathen or a satanist: He forgave her. He told the Samaritan woman where her sin lay, and He forgave her.

I would say that when dealing with people who are choosing to sin, name the sin, but do it with compassion.



:amen: :goodpost:

#11 JerryNumbers

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 03:28 PM

I with you on that point, and I think that in that situation debate and hammering on a point can actually drive a person away from Christ. That's why I said in that situation we should just do our best to show love and move on. However, I missed the part in the post where it was clear that the person in question was into things of Satan. I was asking because I think that we create unnecessary divisions as Christians when we label people who disagree with us as heathens. That may not have been what happened here, but in general, I don't think it's a good practice.


John the Baptist did not make many friend with the lost people. Yet neither did Jesus. About the only way to truly be friends with them is compromise God's truths.

And of course, for a person to be saved, they 1st have to know and admit they be a sinner. Some of them hate for their sin to be exposed, it caused John the Baptist his head, and of course Jesus died on the cross and was hated dearly.

Its really not our job to make lost people love us, and I do not believe its natural for lost people to love those who walk with Jesus.

#12 ThomasCooper

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:03 PM

John the Baptist did not make many friend with the lost people. Yet neither did Jesus. About the only way to truly be friends with them is compromise God's truths.

And of course, for a person to be saved, they 1st have to know and admit they be a sinner. Some of them hate for their sin to be exposed, it caused John the Baptist his head, and of course Jesus died on the cross and was hated dearly.

Its really not our job to make lost people love us, and I do not believe its natural for lost people to love those who walk with Jesus.

Absolutely! We must never compromise the truth of the Word! The Elect will hear their call, and the satanists will reject it one way or the other.

#13 Brother Rick

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:12 PM

Absolutely! We must never compromise the truth of the Word! The Elect will hear their call, and the satanists will reject it one way or the other.



Oh boy.

#14 ThomasCooper

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:12 PM

Satanism is an active worship of satan.


Satanism is not just active warship of satan, as in pentagrams, other occult, direct worship, etc. Catholics worship satan despite believing otherwise. Baal worshipers worshiped satan. Allah worshipers worship satan. In fact, any purposeful rejection of the scripture is worship of satan. Remember Matt 12:30.


If he isn't her husband, then she is not Biblically bound to submit to him unless her husband has given her permission to do so. (and if you are not her husband or pastor, you really don't have Biblical basis to rebuke her...you could, however, go to her husband, if she's married; her pastor if she's not. If you are her pastor, that changes things)

Not true. A woman is to never hold an authority over men. Never. Because the Bible say so. As stated in 1 Tim 2:12, to wit: "But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." This is not a suggestion, as LIEberals would have us believe. This is the law!

I recommend you peruse this preacher's wonderful sermons on the subject:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAmmkl23t8I

Edited by ThomasCooper, 28 July 2010 - 12:13 PM.


#15 HappyChristian

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:40 PM

Satanism is not just active warship of satan, as in pentagrams, other occult, direct worship, etc. Catholics worship satan despite believing otherwise. Baal worshipers worshiped satan. Allah worshipers worship satan. In fact, any purposeful rejection of the scripture is worship of satan. Remember Matt 12:30.



Not true. A woman is to never hold an authority over men. Never. Because the Bible say so. As stated in 1 Tim 2:12, to wit: "But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." This is not a suggestion, as LIEberals would have us believe. This is the law!


Your view of 1 Timothy 2 is your opinion, but it doesn't square with other teachings and patterns in scripture, sorry. The ONLY man who has authority over any woman is her husband (God specifies this when He says a woman is to be subject to her OWN husband). Otherwise, every man could order every woman around. And that is unscriptural all the way around. It would creat total confusion, and God is not the author of confusion. The verse you are basing your opinion on is dealing with a church assembly situation, not all of life.

Paul, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, commended Acquila AND Priscilla, who helped Apollos learn more of Christ. He also commended Pheobe, who actually carried his letter to the Romans (and I feel sure that she actually spoke once in a while). (BTW - the preacher on that video even said that was okay...and he specified a woman shouldn't preach. That's a far cry from having a disagreement)

Yes, there are many lies that LIEberals, as you put it, would have us believe. But there is also an awful lot of man's traditions and opinions being put onto scripture and proclaimed divine.

As to the "law:"

For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.

That's in James 2. Calling a woman who claims to be saved a satanist and a heathen because she doesn't agree with you is absolutely lacking in mercy (and compassion). A person who is devoid of compassion cannot minister to others - all they can do is force their opinions on them and create hard feelings. And, in your own terminology, rejecting the idea of mercy, which is laid out in scripture, and rejecting the idea of compassion, which is also laid out, is satanism.

#16 amblivion

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 01:42 PM

If he isn't her husband, then she is not Biblically bound to submit to him unless her husband has given her permission to do so. (and if you are not her husband or pastor, you really don't have Biblical basis to rebuke her...you could, however, go to her husband, if she's married; her pastor if she's not. If you are her pastor, that changes things)


Not true. A woman is to never hold an authority over men. Never. Because the Bible say so. As stated in 1 Tim 2:12, to wit: "But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." This is not a suggestion, as LIEberals would have us believe. This is the law!

I recommend you peruse this preacher's wonderful sermons on the subject:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAmmkl23t8I


From my understanding of that preacher, he would actually agree with HappyChristian. He said, "She is to sumbit to no man but her husband." While I don't agree with all he says, I don't understand how you came to your conclusions under his teaching. I think he made it pretty clear that a woman is to only sumbit to her husband alone. In the video he also states that no man is going to tell his wife what to do.

I am still a little confused as to where you are coming from. Maybe so we can all better understand you can clarify something for me and maybe everyone else. The woman you called a satanist; is she a woman preacher or did she disagree with you doctrinally or is it a totally different situation. Maybe we could all better respond if we understood the situation.

#17 Annie

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 01:48 PM

My fellow Christians,

Recently I had a debate of sorts with a satanist woman who insisted that she was a Christian. That despite disrespectfully talking to a man. What's more, she and her crowd were adamant in rejecting 1 Tim 2:15, getting upset and rejectionist regarding the reality of her going to hell. How do you deal with such heathens? How do you minister to them?

In the blood of the Lamb,
Brother Thomas


I have a few questions for you, Brother Thomas...
Did you give the woman a chance to explain why she believes that she's a Christian? Did she make a solid profession of faith?
How did she speak disrespectfully to a man? How is that any worse than you (a man) speaking disrespectfully to (or about) her?
Who were "she and her crowd," and how did they "adamantly" reject 1 Timothy 2:15? This verse states: "Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety."
I'm afraid that I would also "get upset" if someone insisted that I am going to hell, when I know very well that God's mercy has saved me.

You asked how one should minister to "such heathens." My first recommendation would be to ask questions instead of condemning them and labeling them with super-charged terms like "satanist," "rejectionist," and "heathen." If these people are truly unsaved, then they are, as Christ said, "like sheep without a shepherd" and should evoke compassion, not condemnation. Condemning isn't our job, anyway. One cannot "minister" to someone after he has chewed them up and spit them out.

Edited by Annie, 28 July 2010 - 01:50 PM.


#18 CPR

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 02:36 PM

I have a few questions for you, Brother Thomas...
Did you give the woman a chance to explain why she believes that she's a Christian? Did she make a solid profession of faith?
How did she speak disrespectfully to a man? How is that any worse than you (a man) speaking disrespectfully to (or about) her?
Who were "she and her crowd," and how did they "adamantly" reject 1 Timothy 2:15? This verse states: "Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety."
I'm afraid that I would also "get upset" if someone insisted that I am going to hell, when I know very well that God's mercy has saved me.

You asked how one should minister to "such heathens." My first recommendation would be to ask questions instead of condemning them and labeling them with super-charged terms like "satanist," "rejectionist," and "heathen." If these people are truly unsaved, then they are, as Christ said, "like sheep without a shepherd" and should evoke compassion, not condemnation. Condemning isn't our job, anyway. One cannot "minister" to someone after he has chewed them up and spit them out.


Annie, I 100% agree. I would also like to know the answers to these questions, if Brother Thomas doesn't mind, I think that would help us all to understand the situation better. Again, I think that it is very dangerous for Christians to throw around terms like "satanist" and "heathen" when someone doesn't agree with us. Especially if that person says they are a Christian.

#19 ThomasCooper

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 08:56 PM

Some answers:

Did you give the woman a chance to explain why she believes that she's a Christian? Did she make a solid profession of faith?
She had a chance to explain that. She did not explain it, just insisted that she "was saved".

How did she speak disrespectfully to a man?
It was a matter of her manner and adamant rejection of the Bible.

How is that any worse than you (a man) speaking disrespectfully to (or about) her?
First off, there is no disrespect in labeling one what he/she is. If one is false Christian, we have to say so. We are most certainly not lie or sugarcoat the truth. (Proverbs 6:16-19)

Who were "she and her crowd," and how did they "adamantly" reject 1 Timothy 2:15? This verse states: "Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety."

She was insisting that she was saved despite not having children. Her crowd were her supporters who like her rejected the Bible and were offensive to myself and other preachers for preaching the Bible.

Hope that answers your heart's questionings.

#20 amblivion

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 09:19 PM

Thomas I am very confused and lost as to what you are saying. Are you saying this woman is not saved because she does not have children? Is she a woman pastor? Your answers are not clear. If you could please help by making your answers more clear and precise we might better understand. What did this woman say to offend you?




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