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Why Women Can't Be Church Leaders/female Pastors?


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#1 pilgrimspen

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 06:51 AM

We had our bible study in the office this afternoon. And I told my Christian workmates that I don't agree women becoming pastors. Because it is written in the bible. There are Christian denominations here who is tolerating or accepts women as preachers. Can you site the passage in the bible where it says so women can't lead or teach in the church. Thanks!

#2 John81

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 07:00 AM

1 Timothy 3:1-13

King James Version (KJV)

3 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

#3 John81

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 07:03 AM

Titus 1:5-9

King James Version (KJV)

5 For this cause left I thee in Crete, that thou shouldest set in order the things that are wanting, and ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed thee:
6 If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;
8 But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;
9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.

#4 pilgrimspen

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 07:13 AM

Wow! John thanks your answer is really fast. Well, I need to prove my fellow Christians & her belief because she wants to be a preacher someday and idolizes Joyce Meyer.
It's really very clear in your post. Well, I need to be prepared because I know she will defend her side and cite something from the bible too!

#5 John81

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 07:32 AM

Wow! John thanks your answer is really fast. Well, I need to prove my fellow Christians & her belief because she wants to be a preacher someday and idolizes Joyce Meyer.
It's really very clear in your post. Well, I need to be prepared because I know she will defend her side and cite something from the bible too!

There is nothing in Scripture that can be used to say a woman can be a preacher because if there was, that would mean the verses above would be contradicted. The verses above are the clear teaching on this matter.

Typically, those who say women can be preachers ignore these verses or try to explain them away. Then they will cite verses that have nothing to do with the qualifications to be a Christian pastor.

The best way to deal with these is to continually point to the above Scriptures which are specifically given to tell us the qualifications to be a preacher. If one rejects the verses above, that in itself disqualifies them from being a pastor because they are rejecting the clear teaching of the Word of God.

#6 HappyChristian

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 11:07 AM

pilgrim, if Joyce Meyer limited herself to teaching women and/or children, there would be no real problem with her teaching. I've got a couple of booklets written by her on biblical dress - and they are quite scriptural. The problem comes in when she teaches men in a formal, church-style setting.

John cited two passages. Here is another one: 1 Cor. 14:34. This passage is dealing with speaking in tongues in the assembly, but it is apropos to your question. "Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."

There is nothing in scripture that your friend can correctly cite that allows a woman to preach (in our understanding of the word). A woman is to be in subjection to her OWN husband...and if she is in the pulpit preaching, she is not in subjection to her husband. If she isn't married, she's in disobedience to scripture telling her to be silent in the church...

#7 JerryNumbers

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 11:29 AM

1Ti 2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.


Ge 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
Ge 3:16 ¶ Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

#8 Standing Firm In Christ

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 02:55 PM

I see different that many on both sides of the fence.I

I believe that a woman can preach, but not pastor.

But I also believe that if a woman is given a message that the congregation needs to hear, she needs to first get permission from her pastor before she stands up and delivers that message. If the pastor gives permission for her to speak, I do not believe she is "usurping authority".

God used women in the Bible over and over. It was two women who were first told to "Go" and tell the good news to the Disciples that Jesus had risen from the dead.

#9 Invicta

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 03:47 PM

I see different that many on both sides of the fence.I

I believe that a woman can preach, but not pastor.

But I also believe that if a woman is given a message that the congregation needs to hear, she needs to first get permission from her pastor before she stands up and delivers that message. If the pastor gives permission for her to speak, I do not believe she is "usurping authority".

God used women in the Bible over and over. It was two women who were first told to "Go" and tell the good news to the Disciples that Jesus had risen from the dead.


That was not teaching.

#10 Standing Firm In Christ

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 04:38 PM

That was not teaching.

It was still the Gospel being proclaimed.

Priscilla was instrumental in teaching men according to Luke's Acts of the Apostles.

Edited by Standing Firm In Christ, 02 July 2012 - 04:40 PM.


#11 HappyChristian

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 04:50 PM

It was still the Gospel being proclaimed.

Priscilla was instrumental in teaching men according to Luke's Acts of the Apostles.


I don't think she stood before the congregation, though, and her name is usually linked with her hubby's. I would agree with your previous post, but would also agree with Invicta. I think it would fall under the category of testimony rather than teaching. Just MHO.

#12 JerryNumbers

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 05:38 PM

I know, many believe a woman can preach, even pastor, yet that's not what the Bible teaches. Its very clear for those whose eyes are not holden.

#13 Standing Firm In Christ

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 05:44 PM

I don't think she stood before the congregation, though, and her name is usually linked with her hubby's. I would agree with your previous post, but would also agree with Invicta. I think it would fall under the category of testimony rather than teaching. Just MHO.

Depends on what the woman is speaking about whether it is testimony or preaching. If she is declaring the Word of God, that would be preaching. And if the pastor gives her permission, she is not usurping authority. And I find nothing in the Word of God that prevents a pastor from allowing a woman in the congregation from sharing a Gospel message.

If she is merely expressing how the Lord has been working in her life, that would be testimony.

Edited by Standing Firm In Christ, 02 July 2012 - 05:45 PM.


#14 JerryNumbers

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 06:28 PM

A pastor has not the authority to allow a woman to preach. In fact a pastor, nor any man, has the authority to let something be done that God has stated is wrong. Preaching is only for men, men who God calls, & He dose not put the desire to preach the Word in the hearts of woman. But perhaps the old Devil will convince the woman that's what she is supposed to do. Yet if she follows the old Devil, she violates the Holy Scriptures.

Testimony would not be preaching. Although a women could start trying to preach while giving their testimony, & that would be a no no.

I've seen singers try to preach in-between & or before their songs, even women singers.

#15 Standing Firm In Christ

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 06:39 PM

Funny, Jesus must have not got that note when He told the women to go and proclaim the Gospel to the Disciples.

#16 Kitagrl

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 10:14 PM

How can a woman "preach" if she is supposed to "keep silence" and "ask her husband at home"?????

Joyce Meyer, while I do have one of her books (would not loan it out), does believe in speaking in tongues.....

#17 Standing Firm In Christ

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 12:04 AM

How can a woman "preach" if she is supposed to "keep silence" and "ask her husband at home"?????

Joyce Meyer, while I do have one of her books (would not loan it out), does believe in speaking in tongues.....

The verse pertaining to a woman asking her husband at home is not addressing preaching. The context is speaking in tongues. A woman was not to speak in tongues.

#18 HappyChristian

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 09:47 AM

A testimony is also proclaiming the Word of God - without preaching. A woman who stands up in church to preach is usurping authority. A pastor who allows it is usurping God's authority. Nowhere in scripture does it validate a woman preaching in church. As to Mary Magdalene - that's a completely different thing. She was not in church, and she was not preaching. She was telling the disciples that Jesus was risen. The Gospel, yes. Preaching, no. That erroneous idea is one of the directions in which the pentecostals have gone awry.

#19 Oldtimer

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 03:37 PM

Help me out folks. I'm not as well versed on this subject as I probably should be.

There's been mention of woman preaching in the church and outside the church. Is that in reference to a physical structure and a congregation of believers gathered there or is 1 Timothy 2 referring to the one true Church in the body of Christ? If the latter, then there's no where a woman can "preach". Correct?

If a woman says she's been called by God to become a preacher is she telling a lie?

If a woman posts scripture and/or gives instruction about scripture, in a forum read by both men and women, is she comitting a sin? Refer to the first question.

If a woman shares the gospel with a man who then comes to Christ what's her status? I'm thinking about outreach to the unsaved in the community around the church. -- Knocking on doors. In that situation a woman can find herself in the "role" of a preacher and teacher as she shares the word of God with a sinner. How fine is the line drawn that she can't cross?

Finally, what is a man's responsibility when he hears (or reads) what he perceives to be "preaching"? In particular, with regards to this forum and the female members posting in various sub-forums. In particular, when a woman is invited, by the pastor, to speak to the congregation during Sunday morning worship services.

In closing, one more question. If a woman is to remain silent in church and 1 Timothy is referring to the true Church, then is there anywhere she can speak outside of the home?

These haven't been issues in our church, thus I probably don't know as much as I should, in the event the issue does rise.

#20 Standing Firm In Christ

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 06:05 PM

1 Corinthians 14 is about tongues. It is not permitted for a woman to speak in tongues.

So many want to say it means a woman is not allowed to speak in Church, but then turn around and try to justify a woman testifying in Church. Funny, eh?

1 Corinthians 14 does not say a woman cannot preach. It has nothing whatsoever to do with who can and cannot preach the Word of God.

1 Timothy 2? Paul's preference, not necessarily what God commanded. Paul said "I" suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over a man.

He did not say God suffers not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over a man. But so many want to make it say just that.

The Greek word for "usurp authority" is the word "authenteo", and simply means "to act of oneself". In 1 Timothy 2, Paul is simply tellng the reader that he does not allow a woman to take charge,

Again, if a pastor tells a woman that she can speak, even deliver a sermon, from the pulpit... she is not acting of herself. She is not "usurping authority."




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