Eric Stahl

America In The Bible

70 posts in this topic

You are both trying to rewrite history to suit your point of view.

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No, we're not. Historians do not agree on the number of tribes that brought down the Roman Empire so there is no way to definitively quote one or two and say, Voila! Here's the answer!

You are trying to wrest clans and chieftains into kings and kingdoms to justify your belief that prophecy of Revelation has already taken place. It has not.

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Jutes settled in Jutland.  Was that part of the Roman Empire?

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Jutes helped settle Britain. That was part of the Roman Empire. And, yes, it is believed to have been. The Cimbri (whom Strabo claimed were Germanic but others believed were Celtic...) lived there and paid tribute to Augustus. Before the fall of Rome.

In point of fact, to highlight the disagreement amongst historians, some believed the Jutes to be the Geats of  Sweden, while others think they might have been Goths. Others believe them to have been associated with the Saxons. 

My point being: there were lots of different groups of people - more than 10 - who helped bring down the Roman Empire. None of them were established kingdoms. And historians cannot agree on the number because these peoples were nomadic. 

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4 minutes ago, HappyChristian said:

Jutes helped settle Britain. That was part of the Roman Empire. And, yes, it is believed to have been. The Cimbri (whom Strabo claimed were Germanic but others believed were Celtic...) lived there and paid tribute to Augustus.

That was later.  They came from Jutland. The Normans (Norsemen) settled in Britain, but they came from France where they settled from Northern Scandinavia   If I remember our history correctly, the Romans withdrew from Britain to concentrate their energies in Europe.

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Yes,I know it was later. And, yes, the Jutes came from Jutland. Unless some historians are right and they came from Sweden. Mayhap the Jutes were a combination of Geats and Goths. :unsure:

 Britain was no longer part of the Empire after 410 (possibly 409). That has nothing to do with the fact that Angles, Saxons, and Jutes fought Rome and aided in its fall. And then went on to settle in Britain.

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The ten kings of the Iron beast will devour the whole earth with the antichrist by the middle of the tribulation see Daniel 7:23-24. This has not happened yet.

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1 hour ago, Eric Stahl said:

The ten kings of the Iron beast will devour the whole earth with the antichrist by the middle of the tribulation see Daniel 7:23-24. This has not happened yet.

Do you know who these ten kings are and how they will accomplish this?

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2 hours ago, John81 said:

Do you know who these ten kings are and how they will accomplish this?

They will come to power with the antichrist after the rapture. 2 Thessalonians 2:6-12 explains that God will cause the people that heard the truth of the gospel but rejected Jesus to believe the lie of the antichrist. God gives the crown to the antichrist who will ride the white horse in the 6th seal. The nations of the western powers who once believed in Jesus will follow the antichrist. NATO will be his army to devour the earth.

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1 hour ago, Eric Stahl said:

They will come to power with the antichrist after the rapture. 2 Thessalonians 2:6-12 explains that God will cause the people that heard the truth of the gospel but rejected Jesus to believe the lie of the antichrist. God gives the crown to the antichrist who will ride the white horse in the 6th seal. The nations of the western powers who once believed in Jesus will follow the antichrist. NATO will be his army to devour the earth.

There are many more than ten formerly "Christian" nations in the West.

How can NATO, which is mostly America, devour the earth?

Just what does "devour the earth" mean?

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2 hours ago, John81 said:

There are many more than ten formerly "Christian" nations in the West.

How can NATO, which is mostly America, devour the earth?

Just what does "devour the earth" mean?

When antichrist and the ten kings devour the whole earth 666 will become king of earth.

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18 hours ago, Eric Stahl said:

When antichrist and the ten kings devour the whole earth 666 will become king of earth.

So we don't know who the ten nations will be or if NATO will have anything to do with this?

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4 hours ago, John81 said:

So we don't know who the ten nations will be or if NATO will have anything to do with this?

Daniel 9:26 tells us the antichrist will come from Roman linage since Rome destroyed Jerusalem. We don't know the Kings but we know the 4th beast of Iron was Rome and it will be Rome and its colonies that first follow the antichrist.

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And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.

12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.

13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

Who but Jesus knew this? The same could happen again while we are looking for Rome.

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15 hours ago, MountainChristian said:

And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.

12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.

13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

Who but Jesus knew this? The same could happen again while we are looking for Rome.

Indeed, in hindsight the First Coming of Christ seems clear, and the Jews at that time certainly thought they understood exactly what Scripture meant regarding the coming of Christ...yet they were wrong.

 

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On 4/9/2014 at 10:58 AM, Nom de Plume said:

I have heard the America "Eagle" Russian "Bear" theory since I was in grade school (that's a long time ago). I've also heard arguments that the Antichrist will come out of Arabia (these are the least credible IMO). I have also seen good studies that place the AC out of the European Union. I personally lean towards the EU theory but am far from dogmatic about it. People far more knowledgeable than I argued out the credibility of each of these theories for many years with little gain towards any theory; and as it has nothing to do with salvation or my scriptural OBedience, I won't argue the point.

 

Having said that, here are some references I have had on hand that give some information on the word Tarshish. There is no support for the British Isles in either reference:

 

From Strong’s Hebrew Dictionary:

 

תַּרְשִׁישׁ Tarshiysh tar-sheesh'

prOBably the same as 8658 (as the region of the stone, or the reverse); Tarshish, a place on the Mediterranean, hence, the ephithet of a merchant vessel (as if for or from that port); also the name of a Persian and of an Israelite:—Tarshish, Tharshish.

 

8658:

תַּרְשִׁישׁ tarshiysh tar-sheesh'

prOBably of foreign derivation (compare 8659); a gem, perhaps the topaz:—beryl.

 

From the Jewish Encyclopedia:

Tarshish appears to have had a considerable trade in silver, iron, tin, and lead (Jer. x. 9; Ezek. xxvii. 12). It gave its name, besides, to a precious stone which has not yet been satisfactorily identifiedSee Gems). The Targum of Jonathan renders the word "Tarshish" in the prophetical books by "sea," which rendering is followed by Saadia. Moreover, the term "ships of Tarshish" is rendered by Jewish scholars "sea-ships" (comp. LXX., Isa. ii. 16, πλοῖα θαλαρρης). Jerome, too, renders "Tarshish" by "sea" in many instances; and in his commentary on Isaiah (l.c.) he declares that he had been told by his Jewish teachers that the Hebrew word for "sea" was "tarshish." In Isa. xxiii. 1 the Septuagint, and in Ezek. xxvii. 12 both the Septuagint and the Vulgate, render "Tarshish" by "Carthage," apparently suggested by Jewish tradition. Indeed, the Targum of Jonathan renders "Tarshish" in I Kings xxii. 48 and Jer. x. 9 by "Afriḳi," that is, Carthage.

 

Josephus ("Ant." i. 6, § 1), apparently reading "Tarshush," identifies it with Tarsus in Cilicia. This identification was adopted by Bunsen and Sayce ("Expository Times," 1902, p. 179); but it seems from Assyrian inscriptions that the original Hebrew name of Tarsus was not "Tarshush." Bochart (in his "Phaleg"), followed by many later scholars, identifies Tarshish with Tartessus, mentioned by Herodotus and Strabo as a district of southern Spain; he thinks, moreover, that "Tartessus" is the Aramaic form of "Tarshish." On the other hand, Le Page Renouf ("Proc. Soc. Bibl. Arch." xvi. 104 et seq.) refutes this theory, declaring besides that Tartessus never really existed. Renouf's opinion is that "Tarshish" means a coast, and, as the word occurs frequently in connection with Tyre, the Phenician coast is to be understood. Cheyne (in "Orientalische Litteraturzeitung," iii. 151) thinks that "Tarshish" of Gen. x. 4, and "Tiras" of Gen. x. 2, are really two names of one nation derived from two different sources, and might indicate the Tyrsenians or Etruscans. Thus the name may denote Italy or the European coasts west of Greece.

 

Personally, where I see America in the Bible is in references like Isaiah 59:2 - 15

 

Isaiah 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.

Isaiah 59:3 For your hands are defiled with blood, and your fingers with iniquity; your lips have spoken lies, your tongue hath muttered perverseness.
Isaiah 59:4 None calleth for justice, nor any pleadeth for truth: they trust in vanity, and speak lies; they conceive mischief, and bring forth iniquity.
Isaiah 59:5 They hatch cockatrice' eggs, and weave the spider's web: he that eateth of their eggs dieth, and that which is crushed breaketh out into a viper.
Isaiah 59:6 Their webs shall not become garments, neither shall they cover themselves with their works: their works are works of iniquity, and the act of violence is in their hands.
Isaiah 59:7 Their feet run to evil, and they make haste to shed innocent blood: their thoughts are thoughts of iniquity; wasting and destruction are in their paths.
Isaiah 59:8 The way of peace they know not; and there is no judgment in their goings: they have made them crooked paths: whosoever goeth therein shall not know peace.
Isaiah 59:9 Therefore is judgment far from us, neither doth justice overtake us: we wait for light, but behold OBscurity; for brightness, but we walk in darkness.
Isaiah 59:10 We grope for the wall like the blind, and we grope as if we had no eyes: we stumble at noonday as in the night; we are in desolate places as dead men.
Isaiah 59:11 We roar all like bears, and mourn sore like doves: we look for judgment, but there is none; for salvation, but it is far off from us.
Isaiah 59:12 For our transgressions are multiplied before thee, and our sins testify against us: for our transgressions are with us; and as for our iniquities, we know them;
Isaiah 59:13 In transgressing and lying against the LORD, and departing away from our God, speaking oppression and revolt, conceiving and uttering from the heart words of falsehood.
Isaiah 59:14 And judgment is turned away backward, and justice standeth afar off: for truth is fallen in the street, and equity cannot enter.
Isaiah 59:15 Yea, truth faileth; and he that departeth from evil maketh himself a prey: and the LORD saw it, and it displeased him that there was no judgment. 

 

Having said that, America certainly looks like an appealing place for the Anti-Christ. Perhaps he'll have a vacation home here...maybe in Hawaii  :biggrin:

Tarshish is the tribe of people who started in Carthage and had colonies in Tyre the Island of Roads Spain and England. In Isaiah 23:6-10 the people of Tyre went back to their mother Tarshish in Carthage. It all became part of the Roman empire. North and South America are colonies of The Tribe of Tarshish and the Roman Empire. The antichrist is the 11th horn that comes out of the 10 horns of the Iron Roman empire from Daniel 7:7-8.

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I once read this - 'America is always mentioned to exist in the scriptures, and most of Israel lives in it's land - JerUSAlem.'

I thought it clever.

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11 hours ago, Genevanpreacher said:

I once read this - 'America is always mentioned to exist in the scriptures, and most of Israel lives in it's land - JerUSAlem.'

I thought it clever.

Zechariah 2:6-7

 

 

6Ho, ho, [come forth], and flee from the land of the north, saith the LORD: for I have spread you abroad as the four winds of the heaven, saith the LORD.

7Deliver thyself, O Zion, that dwellest [with] the daughter of Babylon.

 

 

 
The Russian Jews have gone back to Israel from the north. About 23% of Israel's population came from Russia. So where is the daughter of Babylon from verse 7 that has the Jews that need to go home?
Edited by Eric Stahl

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On 6/11/2016 at 1:24 PM, John81 said:

Do you know who these ten kings are and how they will accomplish this?

Some look at this as at least a model, the 10 economic regions established by the UN:

24lrafo.jpg

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On 9/24/2016 at 9:20 AM, Eric Stahl said:

Zechariah 2:6-7

 

 

6Ho, ho, [come forth], and flee from the land of the north, saith the LORD: for I have spread you abroad as the four winds of the heaven, saith the LORD.

7Deliver thyself, O Zion, that dwellest [with] the daughter of Babylon.

 

 

 
The Russian Jews have gone back to Israel from the north. About 23% of Israel's population came from Russia. So where is the daughter of Babylon from verse 7 that has the Jews that need to go home?

I believe America is the daughter of Babylon because this is where most of the Jews outside Israel are located.

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