I can say this about Peter Ruckman. He stood for the Bible long before any other "known" IFB did and was persecuted for it by the world and his own preacher brethren for years and years.
What do you know..he was right all along but since stigmatized by most, none of the "known" IFBs will admit it.
Bad attitude - sure. I don't always agree with the way his preaches but still excellent messages. Then again many times I do agree with how he preaches. Know it all & authoritative is better than mambie-pambie-gutless any day,
Some on here state heresy referencing inspiration of the KJV translators. NONSENSE, why would that be so hard to fathom? God said His Word is perfectly preserved.
I can tolerate bad attitude when you are right most of the time. Its the know-it-alls I see that are mostly wrong that really annoy me.
I do know this: this gent just took a REAL stand. The kind of stand I reckon most of us big talkers don't know much about.
I doubt him a fool or riding his first rodeo so he had to know his broadcast career would be over before he said all this. How many of us would take a stand like this where you work KNOWING it would be your end there? And I don't mean the little pathetic witnessing here and there in private when the brass ain't looking, I am comparing this to your boss daring you to say something like this and your are fired and you do it anyway. You know, the real suffering for Christ we keep reading about.
I don't know the man's doctrine or if he even gave the Gospel during his rant but I am guessing he ain't no ecumenical. Thanks for sharing this BTW, it was refreshing.
In all kindness I want to say this to Kaoticprofit. I haven't been on this forum long but I think long enough to know that any advocating of blending with mainstream religion in an ecumenical way; any acceptance or tolerance of false Gospels to win the lost through "lifestyle evangelism" won't be supported by and large here (if at all).
I personally think it is sinful or worse-false teaching (not to mention the lazy, easy way out) of our responsibility to preach the true Gospel to the lost.
And I would have to disagree with you. Your theology doesn't save you. Your doctrine though some may be flawed doesn't condemn you. Paul while in prison said,
But I would ye should understand, brethren, that the things which happened unto me have fallen out rather unto the furtherance of the gospel; So that my bonds in Christ are manifest in all the palace, and in all other places; And many of the brethren in the Lord, waxing confident by my bonds, are much more bold to speak the word without fear. Some indeed preach Christ even of envy and strife; and some also of good will: The one preach Christ of contention, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my bonds: But the other of love, knowing that I am set for the defense of the gospel. What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.
First he tell them that his persecution and imprisonment has actually furthered the gospel. Then he goes on to tell them that even though the gospel was being preached with false pretenses or out of envy and strife, "whether in pretense ORin truth," he is still able to rejoice! To me that puts correct behavior above correct doctrine.
Paul rejoices because...Christ is being preached!
For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ, According to my earnest expectation and my hope, that in nothing I shall be ashamed, but that with all boldness, as always, so now also Christ shall be magnified in my body, whether it be by life, or by death.
Sorry sir but the Scripture you quote here isn't remotely close to the point you are attempting to make of it. This passage has zero to do with false teachings of false Christs. False motives in teaching Christ-yes; false teachings of Christ - absolutely not!
Also, referencing religious HQ's websites for their beliefs is the last place to go for understanding about these religions. They all use terminology from the Bible, they all sound close to the Gospel, they all even sound Scripturally correct if you isolate a sentence or even small paragraphs here and there but if you keep reading you will see the falsehoods, holes and heresies.
Like John81 states, corner any of the most devote of these cult groups and they will not provide a clear answer to the question of Heaven or Hell, born again or not, etc..
I don't disagree with you on this..I am kindly stating that you are wrong in these posts.
Many of the quotes folks give from Hyles' sermons on this thread are out of context and were not meant or presented as doctrine. I recognize some and know first hand they were stated BUT as basic illustrations to explain a point Hyles would make. When some of you preachers use an illustration to help your folks understand a doctrine, that doesn't mean the illustration is to be taken literally, does it? Also, the rules espoused to students over obeying authority in the schools were never intended for church members but to keep order in the classrooms and campuses.
I ain't defending anyone on here and idolize no man but I will say this. Jack Hyle's lifelong service to God is being rewarded in Heaven and the prideful fall in his last days does not negate all he did to the Glory of God and saving of souls. He was still flesh and the pride stung him in the end just as all of us are easily vunerable to.
I guarantee this much, Hyles will have allot more crowns to place at Jesus feet than I can possibly imagine and to this day, I am edified, taught and motivated by his sermons which I still listen to online.
BTW: I like Peter Ruckman too, I don't agree with everything but I can say that about most of you gents too HOW YOU LIKE DAT?
There has only been one way for people to be saved throughout history, its never been by sacrificing animals.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Those you speak of that have to die to see the kingdom, they die for the sake of this Savior, because they refuse to deny Him in any manner, even to save this lives.
The only thing works proves is that that person has faith in the Savior.
I am disagreeing with your use of the term "SAVED" brother and the application of it. Saved is NT regeneration, a renewing by the Holy Spirit and only applicable in this church age.
It does not mean the same as justified by faith. The Spirit was not present prior to Christ's ascension (to do the work of regeneration). I will fax you a 100 dollar bill if you can show us a shred of the Word that even hints to that.
Abraham believed God and it was counted to him for righteousness IS NOT the same as being born again.
Not a big deal, not much of a deal at all really but regardless, it is incorrect to keep sticking to that "made up" stuff used to dispute hyper "this and that".
I think we should be grown up enough to recognize the truth without jeopardizing eternal security in our minds. Not that I am saying any of you brethren think that way but the school of thought that "salvation (being born again)" is the same throughout human history is nonsense, not in the Word anywhere and simply not true.
The handful of hardcores in the OT times were justified by faith alone Absolutely but they were not BORN AGAIN brothers, come on. No second birth by the Spirit, no Spirit dwelling in them. They were truely few and far between (during Noah's tiime, he was the only one on the planet-remember).
Granted, they did have signs, wonders and miracles that we do not (at the same time though some also had hundreds of sex partner girlfriends/wives) BUT the Spirit's conviction is MUCH better obviously. God's forever enduring mercy caused Him to send the Spirit which sealed our faith.
Tribulation will be similar to the OT (Noone can say exactly but Revelation certainly leans that way). Oh no, they won't have to earn salvation BECAUSE there won't be any salvation - get it?
During that terrible time they will have to prove their faith to God just as Noah, just as Abraham, just as;;; you get the point.
I wasn't addressing and do not disagree with most of these details - my point was just that salvation has always been and will always be by faith - not of works.
Point of disagreement here: the mystery kept hid from times past was not the gospel (that wasn't a mystery, that was promised since the Garden) but of the Church and that the Gentiles should be made fellow heirs.
I can't even answer this - just keep shaking my head. Salvation has never been by works - the Law was given to prove to men that they couldn't save themselves by their works. So how is it magically going to be by works during the Tribulation? Just for those seven years, and no others, of all time. "Yup, you can be saved by faith, but keep working really hard and be careful or you just might lose it!" Salvation is a free gift by grace - we don't obtain it by our own works, so we cannot keep it by our own works.
We don't know much about the tribulation period, so it's fair that we have different ideas about it, and we need to be flexible remembering that we know little about it and could be wrong. (Yes, I'm speaking to myself here, too.) But when an assumption contradicts the clear teaching of Scripture regarding God's dealing with all other men of all other time, and regarding His single most important message to mankind - I cannot accept that.
Please don't shake your head too hard Salyan, you may get a crick in your neck
I think the confusion you have and others on this thread is the term Salvation. Justification by faith and not of works has always been true - YES I agree.
However, the salvation you and I know in this age is not the same as OT and the tribulation. Not at all. There never was Regeneration, noone was Born again, ie. Born of the Spirit in the OT and they will not be in the tribulation. The problem I see with yours and others thoughts in this thread is that of trying to stand against hyper dispensationalism so hard that it blinds folks to what dispensationism really is.
Most watered down 10%ers in this age would take the mark for a coke. Many will have to die to see the Kingdom during the tribulation.
Don't let one extreme take you all the way to the other, is the point I am making.
IMO Song is exactly correct throughout this thread.
The issue I have with this is the whole God blessing us carnally for serving Him in this carnal world of day to day flesh.
He has no interest in the lost folks day to day life and hears none of their prayers because why? They have not done His Will and believed the Gospel
On the same token, He has no interest in our day to day carnal pursuits. He promised us only food and cloths and then said to be content.
He hears us when we pray in His Will. What is His will, to believe on Him whom He sent and spread that Gospel of whom He sent to the lost. If our prayers are unconnected to that, He hears us not. Our prayers for our sick bothers - Nope: for your promotion at work - Nope; for your lawsuit - Nope. If you won that lawsuit, it is because you pressed and got a good lawyer - God had no interest folks. The Blessings folks refer to over and over are always missing the point IMO it seems. Those Blessings He promises us for doing His Will are Spiritual and Heavenly--not carnal (or of this world) Now
if you pray for your sick brothers to restore them to health so they can continue doing His Will then YES He may hear those, your lawsuit - Nah
Did God bless Paul, Peter, Timothy, any of them with more money for doing His Will? How about a new hat? or chariot?..come on folks, that's the gain as Godliness madness again.
Lazarus the beggar starved to death, didn't have the strength to kill and eat the dogs licking his sores. The apostles all dirt poor (they gave away all their "wealth" to pick up the cross and follow Him) with physical infirmities that nagged at them with chronic pain for years and God stayed out of it even then. and all persecuted in ways our soft brains can never comprehend and they all did FAR MORE for the furtherance of God's Will than I have ever done and suspect everyone currently living today has done. They have their Blessings now though, that God does promise.
But we continue to think that God will answer our lawsuit prayers? our "want mo money" prayers? Lose 10 pounds prayers? IMO of the very clear preaching by Jesus and the apostles, if we waste our time wanting those things we are on our own and God is not in it.
The real issue is do we believe the Word of God, do we really trust God in difficult situations or do we only trust God when it's easy to do so.
Christ said we are to willingly suffer assault, robbery and kidnapping in accord with His Word and example. Christ commanded we overcome evil with good. Christ commanded that Christians are to follow His teachings in such matters and not the Old Testament way of eye for eye. Christians are told that vengence belongs to God alone, we are to love our enemies, pray for them, care for them.
All very hard sayings, as some in Jesus' time admitted. We are told to remember that God's ways are not our ways and following His ways seems foolish to the world.
We have the clear example of Christ, His Apostles and even the early Christians who understood these commands and obeyed them. This was common, accepted practice of Christians until the time of Constantine and the uplifting of the false church of the RCC, the uniting of "christianity" and government, and the mingling of the ways of man into the traditions of christianity.
Agreed. I struggle every day all day with the question: Do I really believe this stuff or not. I know I do so why do I keep caring about things of the world? I don't want to be a 3 a week/10% lukewarm anymore. Convenient and comfortable ain't the way, I know it in my heart just a sissy in the flesh.
Sorry gents, I have no interest in ruffling your feathers. I didn't come up with this - God did. Put in a Scripture change request if you don't like it.
Also sorry about your tithing false teachings. It is a smart way to get at least something out of folks you otherwise wouldn't and make them feel obedient at the same time I guess - but surprise, it ain't in the NT and only referenced to human government in the OT.
Jesus said to LOSE YOUR LIFE IN THIS WORLD is to find it.
No skin off my nose brothers, its between you and Jesus but I know in my heart, its gonna be a painful rude awakening for most Christians at the JSC.
Keep your money to consume upon your own worldly lusts, your hobbys, fancy stuff - after all you deserve it right, you didn't receive it as God says, you earned it SO GLORY IN IT.
Every once in while though, throw an extra 1% at this Christian hobby of yours too. Make it an even 11%